Discussion:
Opera Seria
(too old to reply)
g***@aol.com
2003-11-17 15:26:31 UTC
Permalink
Just what is and what is not an instance of "opera seria"?

Mozart's IDOMENEO is often referred to as an opera seria, but the New
Penguin Opera Guide (edited by Amanda Holden, 2001) lists it as a
"Dramma per musica."

LA CLEMENZA DI TITO, also by Mozart, and indistinguishable from
IDOMENEO in terms of form is listed as an "Opera seria."

Gluck also wrote a CLEMENZA DI TITO but described it as a "Dramma per
musica."
His ORFEO ED EURIDICE he described as an "Azione teatrale per musica"
while his French language rewrite is described as a "Tragédie opéra
(drame héroïque)."

Donizetti's LUCIA DI LAMMERMOOR is styled as "Dramma tragico" while
BELISARIO and POLIUTO are catalogued as "opera seria."

So what's in a name?

Yet, there are those among us who frumpishly insist upon the sanctity
of a term *they* choose not to define.

By the way Ms. Holden's definition is as follows:

"*Opera seria* term now applied to the whole range of Italian language
serios or tragic opera of the 18th and early 19th centuries,
especially as defined by the somewhat stereotyped libretti if
Metastasio (1698--1782)."

==G/P Dave
GRNDPADAVE
2003-11-17 15:30:27 UTC
Permalink
Oops, that should be (correcting my typos):

"*Opera seria* term now applied to the whole range of Italian language
serious or tragic opera of the 18th and early 19th centuries,
especially as defined by the somewhat stereotyped libretti of
Metastasio (1698--1782)."

==G/P Dave
jszostaksr
2003-11-17 16:57:23 UTC
Permalink
G/P Dave: I think it's all the same salami sliced differently! All of these
types of Opera are 'seria - serious' and certainly should be considered as
'dramma/dramatico - drama'. The only difference in the 'tragedia - tragic'
is that some/most/all of the 'dramatis personae' are usually dead at the
play's end. It's all a bunch of semantic BS.

Jon E. Szostak, Sr.
Post by g***@aol.com
Just what is and what is not an instance of "opera seria"?
Mozart's IDOMENEO is often referred to as an opera seria, but the New
Penguin Opera Guide (edited by Amanda Holden, 2001) lists it as a
"Dramma per musica."
LA CLEMENZA DI TITO, also by Mozart, and indistinguishable from
IDOMENEO in terms of form is listed as an "Opera seria."
Gluck also wrote a CLEMENZA DI TITO but described it as a "Dramma per
musica."
His ORFEO ED EURIDICE he described as an "Azione teatrale per musica"
while his French language rewrite is described as a "Tragédie opéra
(drame héroïque)."
Donizetti's LUCIA DI LAMMERMOOR is styled as "Dramma tragico" while
BELISARIO and POLIUTO are catalogued as "opera seria."
So what's in a name?
Yet, there are those among us who frumpishly insist upon the sanctity
of a term *they* choose not to define.
"*Opera seria* term now applied to the whole range of Italian language
serios or tragic opera of the 18th and early 19th centuries,
especially as defined by the somewhat stereotyped libretti if
Metastasio (1698--1782)."
==G/P Dave
Dr. Bruno Campanini
2003-11-17 17:30:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by g***@aol.com
Just what is and what is not an instance of "opera seria"?
Opera Seria and Opera Buffa
In my opinion Opera Seria + Opera Buffa makes the universe of Operas.
Then "tragic", dramatic", "serious" etc. are sub-classes of Opera Seria.
Opera Buffa is a "comic" opera; like Rossini's ones, Die Meistersinger von
Nuernberg, Falstaff, etc.
Xise
2003-11-17 18:26:57 UTC
Permalink
To my knowledge opera seria refers to a drama where people die. Opera buffa is
the opposite, everybody is happy and nobody dies. One very good example is
the Barber of Seville.

Regards,
Ximena
Lis K. Froding
2003-11-19 04:37:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Xise
To my knowledge opera seria refers to a drama where people die.
Opera buffa is the opposite, everybody is happy and nobody dies.
One very good example is the Barber of Seville.
Regards,
Ximena
And here I thought it had to do with them singing in a series,
i.e. no two or more principals singing together, ever.

Last week I saw a performance of Handel's "Oreste," which I'd
definitely classify as an opera seria, since I don't remember
any of the principals singing at the same time as any other;
some of the minor characters might sing in chorus, but otherwise
it was just one voice for five minutes, then another voice for
five, and so on. A tyrannical king is executed, and everyone
(else) is happy.

So, is "Oreste" an opera seria or not?

Lis
AnMeinKlav
2003-11-19 04:41:08 UTC
Permalink
<<So, is "Oreste" an opera seria or not?>>

Yes, though the term has nothing to do with "serial" in the modern sense.
A Tsar Is Born
2003-11-19 07:11:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lis K. Froding
Post by Xise
To my knowledge opera seria refers to a drama where people die.
No. Most of them end happily.
Post by Lis K. Froding
Last week I saw a performance of Handel's "Oreste," which I'd
definitely classify as an opera seria, since I don't remember
any of the principals singing at the same time as any other;
Were you asleep during the major duet of Oreste and Ermione in Act II, Lis?
It was the only time Ermione was on pitch all night.
Post by Lis K. Froding
So, is "Oreste" an opera seria or not?
Yes. (Sort of, in that none of the music was actually composed for Oreste.
So it's a pasticcio, or old-favorites'-night opera seria.)

Hans Lick
Lis K. Froding
2003-11-19 08:05:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by A Tsar Is Born
Were you asleep during the major duet of Oreste and Ermione in Act II, Lis?
Guess so ;-)))

Lis
A Tsar Is Born
2003-11-19 18:34:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lis K. Froding
Post by A Tsar Is Born
Were you asleep during the major duet of Oreste and Ermione in Act II, Lis?
Guess so ;-)))
Too bad. That and Michael Maniaci's arias in Acts II and III were the only
reason to be there. He's pretty fab.

Hans

Pat Finley
2003-11-17 21:51:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by g***@aol.com
Just what is and what is not an instance of "opera seria"?
Mozart's IDOMENEO is often referred to as an opera seria, but the New
Penguin Opera Guide (edited by Amanda Holden, 2001) lists it as a
"Dramma per musica."
LA CLEMENZA DI TITO, also by Mozart, and indistinguishable from
IDOMENEO in terms of form is listed as an "Opera seria."
Gluck also wrote a CLEMENZA DI TITO but described it as a "Dramma per
musica."
His ORFEO ED EURIDICE he described as an "Azione teatrale per musica"
while his French language rewrite is described as a "Tragédie opéra
(drame héroïque)."
Donizetti's LUCIA DI LAMMERMOOR is styled as "Dramma tragico" while
BELISARIO and POLIUTO are catalogued as "opera seria."
So what's in a name?
Yet, there are those among us who frumpishly insist upon the sanctity
of a term *they* choose not to define.
"*Opera seria* term now applied to the whole range of Italian language
serios or tragic opera of the 18th and early 19th centuries,
especially as defined by the somewhat stereotyped libretti if
Metastasio (1698--1782)."
==G/P Dave
I am reminded, in this discussion of opera seria, of Justice Stewart's
comment regarding obscenity -- "I can't define it, but I know it when
I see it." {loose quotation}

One key element that I think Ms Holden's definition overlooks is the
nature of the subject matter. I can't recall ever seeing an opera
defined as opera seria that did not have either a classical or
mythological subject. Some of Metastasio's librettos based on
familiar myths or classical personages were supposedly set by dozens
of composers. Opera seria also, to me, suggests works in which the
singer was free to ornament an aria in any way he or she wished.
Gluck's reforms had to do with better integrating the music with the
drama * as well as allowing the composer to regain control over his
work.

* I've always had the sense that meant that in opera seria composers
frequently wrote music that was inappropriate to the action on stage.
The mature Mozart of course was a master of linking music with text
and character, but doesn't seem to have been overly concerned with
whether others adopted his style; Gluck, I think, approached the
subject from a more theoretical and didactic point of view.

But nothing we have said so far, would indicate exactly when the era
of opera seria ended. Semiramide (and a couple of others of Rossini's
serious operas, like Aureliano in Palmira) seem to fit the opera seria
guidelines fairly well. Rossini was composing in, and just after the
Napoleonic age, when the zeitgeist of western Europe was still
neo-classicism (cf painters like David and Ingres).

But Donizetti's prime begins about 1830 and by then the romantic
revolt was in full flower and classical subjects, if they were treated
at all (cf Shelley's Prometheus Unbound, Keats' Endymion, or
Delacroix' paintings) were treated in a decidely unclassical manner
that was quite alien to the spirit of Idomeneo or La Clemenza.

I don't know Donizetti's opera "Belisario" at all, but I suspect it
is based on the celebrated sixth century general Belisarius whose
career under Emperor Justinian is well chronicled -- i.e. a
semi-classical subject. As is Poliuto/Les Martyrs. But Poliuto seems
to me to be a classical story written in a romantic style. By the time
of Rossini and Donizetti, most serious operas on historical subjects
were no longer set in ancient times (Maometto, Tancredi, Sigismondo,
Elizabetta {Rossini}, and Lucretia Borgia, Anna Bolena, Maria
Stuarda, Roberto Devereux {Donizetti} and many many more.

And thus not, by 'my' definition, not opera seria, at least not in the
original sense.

Pat
stephenmead
2003-11-17 22:58:18 UTC
Permalink
<snip>
Post by Pat Finley
One key element that I think Ms Holden's definition overlooks is the
nature of the subject matter. I can't recall ever seeing an opera
defined as opera seria that did not have either a classical or
mythological subject.
Most opera seria are based on classical or mythological subjects but the
epic poems of Ariosto and Tasso from the Renaissance are
also frequent sources for opera seria, as witness Handel's Orlando, Alcina,
Rinaldo, Ariodante and others and Vivaldi's Orlando Furioso, which are all
opera seria. Handel's opera seria Rodelinda is based on a play by the French
dramatist Corneille about a Gothic Queen and is not from any of these
sources.

<snip>
Post by Pat Finley
But nothing we have said so far, would indicate exactly when the era
of opera seria ended. Semiramide (and a couple of others of Rossini's
serious operas, like Aureliano in Palmira) seem to fit the opera seria
guidelines fairly well. Rossini was composing in, and just after the
Napoleonic age, when the zeitgeist of western Europe was still
neo-classicism (cf painters like David and Ingres).
One of the defining characteristics of opera seria is that the leading man's
part was always written for a castrato. By Rossini's time, this voice was
dying out but the tradition of this kind of voice in the hero's part was one
of the main reasons why he made Arsace in Semiramide a mezzo-soprano.


Stephen
Pat Finley
2003-11-18 20:05:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by stephenmead
<snip>
Post by Pat Finley
One key element that I think Ms Holden's definition overlooks is the
nature of the subject matter. I can't recall ever seeing an opera
defined as opera seria that did not have either a classical or
mythological subject.
Most opera seria are based on classical or mythological subjects but the
epic poems of Ariosto and Tasso from the Renaissance are
also frequent sources for opera seria, as witness Handel's Orlando, Alcina,
Rinaldo, Ariodante and others and Vivaldi's Orlando Furioso, which are all
opera seria. Handel's opera seria Rodelinda is based on a play by the French
dramatist Corneille about a Gothic Queen and is not from any of these
sources.
Stephen
Thanks for the correction. Brain cramp there.

Thanks

Pat
stephenmead
2003-11-17 21:58:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by g***@aol.com
Just what is and what is not an instance of "opera seria"?
Mozart's IDOMENEO is often referred to as an opera seria, but the New
Penguin Opera Guide (edited by Amanda Holden, 2001) lists it as a
"Dramma per musica."
LA CLEMENZA DI TITO, also by Mozart, and indistinguishable from
IDOMENEO in terms of form is listed as an "Opera seria."
Gluck also wrote a CLEMENZA DI TITO but described it as a "Dramma per
musica."
His ORFEO ED EURIDICE he described as an "Azione teatrale per musica"
while his French language rewrite is described as a "Tragédie opéra
(drame héroïque)."
Donizetti's LUCIA DI LAMMERMOOR is styled as "Dramma tragico" while
BELISARIO and POLIUTO are catalogued as "opera seria."
So what's in a name?
Yet, there are those among us who frumpishly insist upon the sanctity
of a term *they* choose not to define.
"*Opera seria* term now applied to the whole range of Italian language
serios or tragic opera of the 18th and early 19th centuries,
especially as defined by the somewhat stereotyped libretti if
Metastasio (1698--1782)."
==G/P Dave
Holden's definition is correct. There were two main kinds of Italian opera
in Mozart's day and he wrote examples of both types - "opera seria", eg
Idomeneo and Clemenza di Tito and opera buffa, most famous ones being
Figaro, Don Giovanni and Cosi. Idomeneo may be described as "drama per
musica" but that is just another term for "opera seria" . In the same way
Don Giovanni is called a "dramma giocoso" but that is just another name for
opera buffa.
Opera seria always has a leading part for a castrato, Idamante in Idomeneo
and Sesto in Clemenza. Opera buffa does not have parts for castrati. Opera
seria, as for instance Handel's operas, is a succession of solo arias with
very few ensembles whereas opera buffa has lots of concerted passages. The
form of opera seria was already rather old-fashioned by Mozart's day and he
added duets, trios and finales to Metastasio's pre-existent libretto of
Clemenza when he set it.
Despite the name, opera serias always have "happy endings".
French operas had different terminologies and Gluck was trying to reform
opera so he made up original terms for some of his works.
By the time of Romantic operas such as Donizetti's, opera seria has lost its
original meaning and just signifies a work that is not comic.
The opera seria you are most likely to see performed today are Handel's, in
addition to the two Mozart works you have mentioned.
Stephen
Sailbad Sinner
2003-11-18 07:22:44 UTC
Permalink
{snip} ... There were two main kinds of Italian opera
in Mozart's day and he wrote examples of both types - "opera seria", eg
Idomeneo and Clemenza di Tito and opera buffa, most famous ones being
Figaro, Don Giovanni and Cosi.
As you say, Mozart did write examples of *both* types - and in the
same opera! This is where his genius is (or part of his genius). Take
don Giovanni, for example. Anna is an opera seria character, Zerlina
certainly belongs in the buffa tradition and Elvira balances nicely in
between. The novelty in don Giovanni lies partially in the fact that
buffa and seria characters are successfully combined without making a
slapstick farce out of it. In le Nozze, the countess is an opera seria
type, while the rest of the cast are mostly buffa types.

(When I say that Anna and the countess are opera seria types, I mean
musically. Traditional opera seria deals with royal or divine
characters, as someone already remarked.)
AnMeinKlav
2003-11-18 01:32:44 UTC
Permalink
<<Yet, there are those among us who frumpishly insist upon the sanctity
of a term *they* choose not to define.>>

There's no mystery about the term as it is conventionally applied in operatic
history. Grout lists several defining characteristics of this operatic genre of
the eighteenth century:

1) Libretti that featured royal and noble personages, free of irrelevant comic
episodes, supernatural events, deus ex machinae, and "bombastic declamation,"
whatever that means, almost always with a happy ending.

2) Musical structure consisting almost exclusively of alternating recitative
(mostly secco, accompanied only by continuo) and aria. Choruses and ensembles
are rare.

3) A preponderance of the da capo aria form.

4) The glorification of the solo singer to the exclusion of other musical
values. The heyday of the castrati, famed for their vocal virtuosity and
improvisatory skill in ornamentation.

Mozart's Idomeneo largely matches 1), 2) and 4); not so much 3). By these
criteria, opera seria is not at all an appropriate term for the tragic operas
of the bel canto age such as Lucia or Semiramide.
A Tsar Is Born
2003-11-18 05:46:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by AnMeinKlav
There's no mystery about the term as it is conventionally applied in operatic
history. Grout lists several defining characteristics of this operatic genre of
1) Libretti that featured royal and noble personages, free of irrelevant comic
episodes, supernatural events, deus ex machinae, and "bombastic declamation,"
whatever that means, almost always with a happy ending.
You mean opera seria lacks such episodes, or that it includes them merely
when they are "relevant" ?
Certainly there are plenty of supernatural events and dei ex machinae in
o.s.
And some of Handel's operas (Xerxes, Parthenope) are comic, in part.
But they are knit into the fabric.

And the happy ending does not exclude tragedy entirely -- I'm thinking of
Mitridate's suicide at the end of Mozart's Mitridate. (But that was put
there, perhaps, because the event was the most famous thing remembered about
Mitridate in Mozart's day -- nowadays, nothing at all is remembered about
him.) And true love and patriotism conquered all.
Post by AnMeinKlav
2) Musical structure consisting almost exclusively of alternating recitative
(mostly secco, accompanied only by continuo) and aria. Choruses and ensembles
are rare.
I would add that while small ensembles (mostly duets or finales) are not
uncommon in Handel's o.s., they are almost invariably "single-minded" --
that is, both characters are miserable together (Giulio Cesare, end of Act
I), or in love with each other (G. Cesare, end of Act III; Rinaldo Acts I
and III), or detest each other (Rinaldo Act II). Handel was, as it were,
exploring his aria style by giving his single protagonist two voices.

When Grandpadave objects that there's so much more movement in the ensembles
in Mozart's da Ponte operas, he is quite right and has identified a major
reason they are not opera seria. They were breakthroughs in the buffa form;
and do not relate to what Mozart was called upon to do in opera seria. This
is why the quartet in Idomeneo seems less dramatic -- he is writing an
"aria" for a single four-part soloist, as required by opera seria
convention. (But doing this, so exquisitely, for four soloists at once, was
very "advanced.")

There are exceptions to this: the trio in Act III of Alcina, e.g., when the
lovers battle with Alcina -- but that too does not develop different,
contrasting emotions -- only contrasting voices in the same wrathful
emotion.

The chorus is never a principal character in opera seria. This is true even
in the interesting choral parts of Idomeneo, and is one reason Gluck's
reform operas can (and should) be distinguished from opera seria: In Orfeo,
the chorus is the second most important character, serves many functions,
and the various character of its music undergirds many of the scenes: the
Furies but also Elysium, the mourners of the opening and the rejoicing of
the conclusion.

Gluck derived this style in large part from French opera, the
Lully-Charpentier-Rameau tradition that has recently returned to a certain
vogue. It is nothing like opera seria, and is far more ancestral to Gluck's
famous operas than anything in the Italian form.

(Gluck also wrote lesser known operas in every other form he knew of --
opera seria, opera buffa, and singspiel. If he'd been Mozart, he might have
put them all together. And Gluck, in turn, is a more significant ancestor of
Berlioz than Mozart or Rossini are. Part of the fun of getting to know Gluck
is seeing how he prefigures Berlioz, and of getting to know Berlioz is
seeing how he drew from Gluck. While cross fertilization was constant, the
national schools remained separate for a very long time. Rossini, Donizetti,
Meyerbeer and Verdi follow Gluck in attempting to write in several different
national styles, but they developed a new more international style in doing
so.)
Post by AnMeinKlav
3) A preponderance of the da capo aria form.
4) The glorification of the solo singer to the exclusion of other musical
values. The heyday of the castrati, famed for their vocal virtuosity and
improvisatory skill in ornamentation.
This is, methinks, the heart of it. While we have learned in recent years
just how much drama can be brought out in these scores by sensitive,
intelligent, musicianly performers, they can also be performed in shallow,
merely virtuosic ways.

I think I would add
5): Opera seria is in Italian. (Plenty of non-Italians composed them, but
only in the Italian language.) The French serious opera is entirely
different, in balance, in style of singing, in choral (and dance)
participation. The German serious opera was never so formal or without
extraneous interludes. (I don't know Arne's serious English operas -- how
close to Handel were they?)
Post by AnMeinKlav
Mozart's Idomeneo largely matches 1), 2) and 4); not so much 3). By these
criteria, opera seria is not at all an appropriate term for the tragic operas
of the bel canto age such as Lucia or Semiramide.
Completely agree.

It is surprising Tito held the stage as long as it did (about forty years).
By that time, there must have been very few other 18th-century opere serie
still holding the boards anywhere. Even in southern Italy, new styles had
taken over, the castrati were gone forever, and everyone expected a certain
dramatic involvement from the performer and ensembles in new works.

Hans Lick
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